45683968 Where did God come from? Where did God come from? The Origin of God

COPYRIGHT 2017

WHERE DID GOD COME FROM?   

and

How did the Trinity first come into existence?

“How could an eternal God with no beginning ever 

come into existence in the first place and still be 

eternal with no beginning?”

 (i.e. “Where did God come from?”)

 

“How did the inseparable Trinity ever become 

an inseparable Trinity in the first place?”

 

For more than 50 years I have asked myself these questions and asked God for the answers.  Well, I finally have an answer that I will share with you during this essay. It may not be the right answer, but I guarantee that you will never have heard of this answer before. And although my answers have a scientific basis, a Biblical basis and a logical basis (and to my knowledge, also have the virtue of never having been presented before), they could still be wrong.  You'll just have to listen to my reasoning and decide for yourself.  That being said, let us begin.

I believe the answer to the origin of an eternal God with no beginning and the origin of the Trinity is directly related to another question,

"Can God create time?"

(Although God can manipulate time

[now that time already exists] 

the question remains,

"Could God have created time in the first place?")

Because if God could never have created time in the first place, then after a few simple steps of logic, you will discover for yourself...

"how an eternal God with no beginning could

have come into existence in the first place

and still be eternal with no beginning."

 

And at the same time, you will also solve the mystery of the Trinity by knowing...

"how the inseparable Trinity became

an inseparable Trinity in the first place."

Now at this point, many of you are already thinking,

"The information in this guy's essay is worthless.  After all,

if something is eternal, then it cannot possibly have

a beginning. And if something has a beginning,

then it cannot possibly be eternal.  So there is no

way anyone can ever explain how an eternal God

with no beginning could have come into existence in

the first place and still be eternal with no beginning. 

Well, I used to believe that and teach that.  But then I discovered that there is actually one exception to that rule.

You are also probably thinking,

"The Bible teaches that God is eternal so he

certainly could never have had a beginning. Plus,  

God created all things, so God certainly created time,

and since God is all-powerful, then creating time itself

should be no problem for an all-powerful God."  

Yeah, I used to believe that and teach that too.  

 

But before we start, we must first recognize that time itself is not simply perception or intuition.  Time itself is a real "thing" that exists that can be effected by extreme gravity in a way that can actually slow down time itself. Scientists call this phenomenon: time dilation.  This is why scientists believe that the extreme gravity within a black hole will cause time to stop completely. So we know time is a real "thing", otherwise gravity would not be able to slow it down.  Gravity could certainly never slow down time if time itself was simply a matter of perception of the mind and not an actual thing that gravity could “grab hold of”, so to speak.

 

Besides, if time itself (the time-part of spacetime) was nothing more than perception, intuition, or imagination without any underlying physical cause, then spacetime itself could never exist, because instead of space + time = spacetime, it would be space + perception = space.   

 

Therefore, since time itself has to be an actual "thing" that exists in the real world, we can now ask the following question:

“How could God create time itself 

without time itself already being in existence?”

  

 

Now the Church teaches that God created all things, including time itself, and I have believed and taught that all my adult life. Yet the Bible NEVER addresses the issue of whether God specifically created the "thing" that is time itself.  And so in November of 2014, I finally recognized that God could never have created time for the same reason that God could never have created himself—and this problem cannot be overcome simply by claiming that God is outside of time or claiming that God transcends time.

You see, it is a logical impossibility for God to have created time from within a timeless realm in the first place, because creating time requires time to exist (during the creating) and not exist at that very same moment (during which, time still needs to be created because time does not yet exist).  In other words, if time did not yet exist, in order for God to create time in the first place, a moment in time must already exist during which God recognizes his need to create time; a second moment in time must already exist during which God designs a plan to create time; and a third moment in time must already exist during which God implements his plan to create time, and all three of these moments in time must exist precisely at a time when time itself does not yet exist in order for time to still need to be created.  And this unsolvable paradox doesn't disappear simply by claiming God is "outside of time", or God "transcends time", because no matter what timeless realm or dimension we imagine God to be in when God is "outside of time", God still cannot create time in that realm unless time already exists in that realm, because creating time in any realm will always require time to exist and not exist at the very same moment in that very same realm, thereby violating the Law of Non-Contradiction.  

 

(The Law of Non-Contradiction states that something

cannot be both true and not true at the same time in

the same context in the same sense.)

https://carm.org/dictionary-law-of-non-contradiction

 

For the same reason that God could never have created time, God could never have created himself either, for that would require God himself to exist (in order to do the creating) and not exist at the very same moment (in order for that non-existing God to still need to be created).  This second scenario also violates the Law of Non-Contradiction. So if God was ever "outside of time" in a place where time itself did not yet exist, then God would literally never have time to create time in the first place in order to have the time later on to do anything else. It should be self-evident therefore, that without the previous existence of time itself, God himself would be “frozen in time” (so to speak) and would not be able to create anything, do anything or even think anything, because even an instantaneous creation still requires a moment in time to exist during the instant of creation as well as before the instant of creation when the newly created thing did not yet exist.

 

And you cannot get around this argument simply by saying, "God is all powerful and so God can do anything", otherwise, using that logic, God should be able to create himself without requiring God to exist and not exist at the very same moment.  Most Christians recognize that God could never have created himself because that would require God to exist and not exist at the same moment, which is a logical impossibility and violates the Law of Non-Contradiction.

 

Yet 100% of those same Christians who believe that God could never have created himself still believe that God could and did create time, even though creating time requires time itself to exist and not exist at the very same momentanother logical impossibility that also violates the same Law of Non-Contradiction. 

 

BOTH are logical impossibilities because BOTH violate the same Law of Non-Contradiction in the same way!

So, for the same reason that it is a logical impossibility for God to ever have created himself, it is the identical logical impossibility for God to ever have created time itself from within an initially timeless realm.

Therefore, all Christians who believe that God could never have created himself but who also believe that God could still have created time have a double standard for interpreting and applying the rule that says,

"No thing (i.e. whether God or time) can exist

and not exist at the very same moment in the

very same sense."

We Christians apply this rule to God by reasoning, "It is impossible for God to exist and not exist at the same moment. Therefore, God could never have created himself." Yet we refuse to apply this same rule to time itself, a refusal that allows us to continue believing that God created time. Instead,  we reason that, "Somehow, it must be possible for time to exist and not exist at the very same moment (in some unimaginable way), otherwise God could never have created time." Thus we reason one way for God and just the opposite way for time.  This is a clear double standard for our reasoning. And a double standard for reasoning is also a logical Fallacy of Inconsistencyapplying rules and criteria to one argument, belief, claim or position but not to others.  And by definition, a logical fallacy is an instance of incorrect reasoning that creates an invalid form of argument.  

So at this point, every single one of you who believes that God could never have created himself, but who also believes God could still have created time, is not only mistaken in his reasoning, but you have adopted a double standard, a logical fallacy, an instance of incorrect reasoning and an invalid form of argument. (Pardon my redundancy.)  So give it up!  You are simply wrong. God could never have created time under any circumstances.

But there is another paradox that comes from the idea that God could never have created time.  And this paradox has an even closer relationship to the issue of the origin of an eternal God.  

 

It turns out that an ETERNAL God couldn’t even exist before the existence of time in order for God to create time to begin with, because no matter when God would create time, a truly eternal God would have already lived an eternity of time prior to that moment, otherwise he wouldn’t be eternal. But an eternal God could never be living for millions of "years" (or living for any other "measure of eternal time") prior to creating time in the first place, since for millions of "years" to pass, time would have to already exist. This paradox also requires time to exist and not exist at the same moment and therefore also violates the Law of Non-Contradiction. Accordingly, an ETERNAL God could never have even EXISTED before the existence of time. (Do you see how we are now getting closer to the issue of the origin of an eternal God?)

 

But if God were anything less than eternal before he created time, then God would have to have a beginning.  However, if God had a beginning, then if there was nothing already in existence from which God could emerge, then God would have to create himself—something that even God could never do, because that would require God himself to exist and not exist at the same time, creating yet another paradox which again violates the Law of Non-Contradiction. So, neither an ETERNAL God nor a NON-ETERNAL God could exist (even for a short period) before time itself existed in order for God to create time in the first place.

 

This bears repeating:

An eternal God could never be living for millions of

"years" before the existence of time (since for millions

of "years" to pass, time would have to already exist).  

Therefore, it is impossible for an eternal God to exist

before the existence of time in order for God to create

time in the first place.

OK.  

 

Are you ready to hear about the origin of God now? 

 

Based upon the idea that God could never have created time in the first place, we learn at least five amazing things.  

First, since we know time is a "thing" that exists, and since we now know that God could never have created time, then

Time itself must be Uncreated,

Uncaused, and naturally eternal.

Second, since we now know that God could never have created time, then

God cannot possibly be the one and only

Uncaused First Cause of absolutely everything

(because God could never have created time).

 

Thirdsince we now know that an eternal God could ever have even existed before time existed, then

God cannot possibly be older than eternal time,

 

Therefore,

eternal time must be older than God.

But if eternal time is older than God, 

then this creates the ultimate paradox:

Our Eternal God must have had a Beginning!

Fourth, by definition, only the one and only Uncaused First Cause never had a Beginning.  Also by definition, everything other than the one and only Uncaused First Cause must have a beginning as an effect of the one and only Uncaused First Cause.  Therefore,  since

God cannot possibly be the one and only

Uncaused First Cause of absolutely everything

(because God could never

have created time itself),

then

God must have had a Beginning as an Effect

of the one and only Uncaused First Cause.

 

Fifth, since our eternal God must have had a Beginning and since eternal time must be older than God, then 

Our eternal God had to come into existence AFTER

eternal time, which means that our eternal God had

to literally come FROM eternal time. 

But if God came FROM time, then God must be LIVING TIME—specifically 4-Dimensional Living Spacetime—which means that the Trinity must be the Living Past (the Father), the Living Present (Jehovah/Jesus), and the Living Future (the Holy Spirit).  (This does NOT mean however, that the Father ONLY lives in the past or that the Holy Spirit ONLY lives in the future.)

Another way to arrive at the same conclusion is this: 

Since God cannot possibly be the Uncaused First

Cause (because God could never have created time),

then if God is not the Uncaused First Cause,

what indeed is the Uncaused First Cause?  

 

The Uncaused First Cause must something that is

Uncaused, naturally eternal, that pre-existed God and

that God himself could never have created

eternal time itself


So, as incredible as this sounds, once we accept the idea that time itself is an actual THING that can be influenced and altered by the laws of physics (i.e. slowed down by gravity), and that God could neither have created the THING that is time itself, nor could God have even existed before time existed, the only possible conclusion is that God himself must have come AFTER eternal time and so God must have come FROM eternal time.  Therefore, God must be Living Time (actually, Living Spacetime) and almost by definition, the Trinity must be the Living Past (the Father), the Living Present (Jehovah/Jesus) and the Living Future (the Holy Spirit).  As far as I can tell, no other possibility exists.

 

Of course, since God could never have created time, Christ would never say, “I created the Beginning…”.  And since God could never have existed before time, Christ would never say, “I existed before the Beginning…”  But as Living Time, Christ would literally be the Beginning, so it would be only natural for Christ to say, “I AM the Beginning…” (Revelation 22:13), a statement that strongly suggests,​

 

“I AM [literally] the Beginning and the End"

—the Living Past and the Living Future.  

This is who and what I actually am and this is

who and what the Trinity actually is

—The Living Past, the Living Present and the 

Living Future. And since time itself has always

been naturally eternal with no beginning,

then it should be self-evident that,

once time (as spacetime) literally became alive, 

that likewise, I too would become naturally eternal

with no beginning, because I AM Living Time itself."

 

Thus, both logic and the Bible confirm (at least to me) that somehow, an eternity ago, inanimate three-part spacetime itself (the past, present and the future) did indeed become alive as three living beings (the Living Past, the Living Present and the Living Future).

So, how do I personally answer the question:

“How could an eternal God with no beginning

ever come into existence in the first place and

still be eternal with no beginning?” 

 

My answer is, 

Mankind should have recognized long ago that,

Only a non-living entity (like time itself) that is already

naturally eternal with no beginning that transitions 

into being alive can explain the origin of a living God 

who is likewise naturally eternal with no beginning.”

And since eternal time has always existed in three parts—the inanimate past, present and future (relative to any given point in time, of course)—the only possible form of life that could ever arise from time itself must by necessity also exist in those same three parts, and therefore become the Living Present (i.e. the first part of time itself that became alive), the Living Past and the Living Future—a Trinity of living beings existing within one body of eternal time. 

 

Since by definition, the first part of time itself that becomes alive, conscious and self-aware would naturally be considered the relative “present” (and therefore become the Living Present—Jehovah/Jesus), then as this “aliveness” travels forwards and backwards in time like a wave on the ocean, spreading from the “present” into the eternal past and into the eternal future, then the rest of eternal time would naturally be divided into (and would therefore naturally become) the Living Past and the Living Future respectively (i.e. the Father and the Holy Spirit). But in addition, even though the Living Present would be the first part of God to actually become "alive", as the "aliveness" of time travels backward into all eternity past, God, the Living Past would eventually become completely alive trillions of years before the Living Present first became alive to begin with. And because this newly alive God is now alive throughout all past eternity and future eternity, we end up with a newly alive completely eternal God with no beginning at all! Imagine thata newly alive eternal God with no beginning! 

 

Accordingly, since time itself (the past, present and future) is naturally eternal with no beginning, then when eternal time transitions from being inanimate into being alive, the resulting newly alive being would likewise be naturally eternal with no beginning, because the living being that is newly alive is, in fact, eternal time itself with no beginning—and therefore would naturally become the Living Past, the Living Present and the Living Future—an inseparable Trinity without beginning and without end.  

 

Mankind should have recognized this self-evident truth centuries ago:

Only a non-living entity composed of three inseparable parts (like time itself) that is naturally eternal with no 

beginning that transitions into being alive (starting from 

the relative “present”) can explain the origin of a living

Trinity of three inseparable beings who are likewise

naturally eternal with no beginning.”

 

(Consider this: if Siamese Triplets were ever to survive, this would be three living beings existing within one human body. Likewise, the Trinity are three living beings existing within one body of eternal spacetime.  And just like the Siamese Triplets can never separate themselves from each other, the Trinity can never separate themselves from each other either. Additionally, just like you can never mechanically separate the past from the present, or separate the present from the future without destroying the nature of time itself, likewise you can never separate the Living Past from the Living Present, or separate the Living Present from the Living Future without destroying the Trinity.  As I said, this is the only possible origin of the Trinity that would make these three beings to become naturally inseparable and still be eternal with no beginning—because time itself is naturally eternal with no beginning.

 

Since this is the only possible answer to the question, then this must be how our eternal God with no beginning originally came into existence.

So let me summarize my theory,

    “Time itself is an actual thing that can be slowed down

by gravity.  However, since God could neither have 

created the thing that is time nor could an eternal God

have even existed before time existed, then time itself must have existed before God existed and so time itself must be Uncaused, Uncreated and naturally eternal.  

Therefore, since God could never have existed before 

time existed, then God must have come into existence

after time existed.  But if God came after time, then by

default, God must have come from time, which means

that God himself must be Living Time—specifically

four-dimensional Living Spacetime.  After all, 

only a non-living entity (like time itself) that is naturally

eternal with no beginning that transitions into being

alive can explain the origin of a God who is likewise

naturally eternal with no beginning.  

Accordingly, theTrinity must be the Living Past

the Living Present, and the Living Future.  

No other possibility exists.”

 

That being said, most people will still disagree with my hypothesis (at least initially) for six different reasons, especially when I cannot explain it to them in person. First, it’s a totally new idea and most people tend to reject new ideas. Second, it’s a wild idea, and even more people reject wild ideas. Third, it’s a more complicated idea than simply believing that God has always been eternal with no beginning at all, and therefore also more likely to be rejected. Fourth, it appears to be a demeaning idea, because the notion that an eternal God could originally have had a beginning (plus the notion that God could have “evolved” from time itself) will always be initially perceived as discrediting God’s eternal nature, and an even greater number of people reject ideas that are perceived as demeaning their previously cherished ideas.  Fifth, it’s an idea from a source with unknown credibility (i.e. me). Therefore, since my idea is new, wild, complicated, possibly demeaning and comes from a source with unknown credibility, I expect it to be viewed with skepticism, if not rejected altogether.

 

The sixth reason why many of you might reject my hypothesis that “an eternity ago, spacetime itself became alive” is because you simply cannot imagine how spacetime could actually become alive in the first place, much less become a conscious, self-aware, loving God. However, you must admit that prior to reading this essay, none of you even thought about this idea one way or the other, much less spent any time actually developing a model of what would it take for a four-dimensional life form that was not made from normal energy and matter to become alive and conscious in the first place.  And since you have never even thought about this issue before, then you may not yet have the proper grounds for rejecting my hypothesis, at least not until you read Essay 2, the essay that explains how four-dimensional spacetime itself might actually have become alive.  If you want to read about this novel idea, simply go to the bottom of this page and click on Origin of God--Essay 2.   

In Essay 2, I explain why, since gravity effects objects with energy (like planets, moons, comets, and photons), then since gravity can also slow down time itself, then time itself must likewise contain some infinitesimal form of energy within it as well (energy that gravity can "grab hold of", so to speak, in order for gravity to be able to slow down time) and why this infinitesimal amount of the energy of time must also be simultaneously located at every single infinitesimal point within the entire giant sphere of our 93 billion light-year diameter universe, and why the total energy of time within our own universe here in the present would naturally also be simultaneously located at every single infinitesimal point in the eternal past and future as well, all of which would obviously total to an INFINITE amount of energy that would be contained within eternal time itself.  I also explain why the infinite energy of time itself is probably the same as dark energy, and since dark energy is repulsive energy that can create space and expand the universe, that a long time ago, the energy of eternal time created the space that became spacetime. I then present a theoretical model of God’s actual body, brain and mind, and then describe a process by which the infinite repulsive energy of time would naturally create a complex structure made out of pure space—a relatively small, but perfectly spherical, slowly expanding space surrounded by trillions of layers of densely compressed, folded space that could easily function as a four-dimensional, universe-sized information-gathering and processing system, which (because it would all be powered by the infinite energy of time itself) would inevitably become alive, conscious, all-knowing and all-powerful, but also naturally indifferent.  

 

Then, in Essay 3, I do my best to explain why, millions of years later, this indifferent all-powerful God would inevitably become an all-loving, all-powerful God, and explain why such a God would inevitably choose to create and to save mankind.

Of course, most people who hear such a foreign-sounding idea will simply dismiss it out of hand without creating a well-thought-out rebuttal.  But dismissing an idea without providing an actual rebuttal is not a refutation. Whenever you deliberately dismiss your opponent’s proposition without a rebuttal in order to come to a conclusion that avoids the influence of your opponent’s evidence, you are actually committing a logical fallacy, specifically a Fallacy of Exclusionimportant evidence that would refute an argument is deliberately excluded from consideration.  In this case, it is the important evidence that completely refutes the traditional Christian belief (that God created time) that is deliberately excluded from consideration without any actual refutation—a classic Fallacy of Exclusion. And by definition, a logical fallacy is an instance of incorrect reasoning that creates an invalid form of argument. 

 

So, if you disagree with my conclusion that God is Living Time (specifically, four-dimensional Living Spacetime), but you still would like to refute my idea without simply dismissing my idea and committing a logical Fallacy of Exclusion, then you must create a well-thought-out rebuttal (even if it’s just in your own mind). To do this, you must first click on and read the essays below, specifically, Essay 1b. You'll see why, once you read it.